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Trades
Jan 13, 2010 12:27:07 GMT -5
Post by soccertodd4osu3 on Jan 13, 2010 12:27:07 GMT -5
Im in favor of no trades until after the draft. I mean come on there r still top 100 players available and nobody even knows who they wuill have on their team at the end so I agree w/ Showdad... No trades until the first initital draft of this league is complete. No hate towards anyone I just want this league to be run right and things to be fair for all members. Once the draft is complete all trade proposals that are agreed upon by the 2 teams involved get announced and just like the draft if by the end of 24 hrs 2 people don't vote against it to bring the trade to a vote then it goes through. If 2 people vote against it it goes to a vote and u need 4 out of 12 votes to veto it, no commentary allowed as to why u do or don't like the trade just a simple vote so nobody is swayed by others. I think this is the way to do it, eliminating all the arguing and confusion.... Any thoughts?
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Trades
Jan 13, 2010 15:24:09 GMT -5
Post by donbrockus on Jan 13, 2010 15:24:09 GMT -5
all i read was the first sentence of soccertodd's recent post. im not against trades at this point in the draft. i dont see the need in having to complete the draft first in order to begin trades. if you feel that way, personally, about your own team, then by all means, go for it, but i dont think every team should have to wait.
as for gzimm. yes. nelson cruz makes up some of the lobsidedness. but tulo is a shortstop. cruz and kubel are outfielders. the depth at the OF position is so much greater than that of shortstops. so while cruz is better than kubel, there are so many good outfielders of that quality that it doesnt make up for the shortstop advantage and overall heavy lobsidedness of the trade.
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Trades
Jan 13, 2010 16:08:03 GMT -5
Post by gzimm32 on Jan 13, 2010 16:08:03 GMT -5
Well Don, the depth at 3b is minimal this year and I was counting on Beckham. There are more solid SS than 3rd basemen at this point, which is weird, but that's how I see things right now. If you guys see 600 ABs of Beckham this year, I think you'll see why this is not a lopsided deal, regardless of what round of a league with 8 keepers these players were taken in.
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Trades
Jan 13, 2010 16:24:24 GMT -5
Post by donbrockus on Jan 13, 2010 16:24:24 GMT -5
im not looking at rounds. im looking at stats. and i do not agree about the SS/3B comment you made. you think depth at 3B is minimal?
solid SS: 1. Hanely 2. Tulo 3. Jeter 4. Reyes 5. Rollins 6. Bartlett?
solid 3B: 1. A Rod 2. Wright 3. Longo 4. Reynolds 5. Zimmerman 6. Youk 7. Sandoval 8. Figgins 9. A Ram 10. Young 11. Chipper 12. Beckham
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Trades
Jan 13, 2010 16:28:13 GMT -5
Post by Matt on Jan 13, 2010 16:28:13 GMT -5
He did say more solid 3B "at this point" not at the beginning of the draft.
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Trades
Jan 13, 2010 16:33:06 GMT -5
Post by donbrockus on Jan 13, 2010 16:33:06 GMT -5
i just listed 12 solid 3B. one is available. im sure each team probably has at least one solid 3B. i listed 6 SS. we have 12 teams. none of those 6 are available. plus guys like escobar, alexei, and drew are also taken. so the likelihood of your team having a solid SS is not as likely as your team having a solid 3B. "at this point"
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Trades
Jan 13, 2010 16:33:19 GMT -5
Post by gzimm32 on Jan 13, 2010 16:33:19 GMT -5
He did say more solid 3B "at this point" not at the beginning of the draft. There's the key. You can talk about whatever depth you want for the entire league. If you look at those lists, how many of those guys were ever available in the draft? I think of the non-keepers, 3b was more limited. I'd agree with you Don, that OF is deeper, but it pretty much always is and that is not what is in question here. Regardless, what I'm bothered by at this point is a lack of understanding another person's point of view as opposed to the fact that the trade won't go through.
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Trades
Jan 13, 2010 16:34:44 GMT -5
Post by donbrockus on Jan 13, 2010 16:34:44 GMT -5
we posted at the same time. i'll post this again
i just listed 12 solid 3B. one is available. im sure each team probably has at least one solid 3B. i listed 6 SS. we have 12 teams. none of those 6 are available. plus guys like escobar, alexei, and drew are also taken. so the likelihood of your team having a solid SS is not as likely as your team having a solid 3B. "at this point"
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Trades
Jan 13, 2010 16:35:44 GMT -5
Post by soccertodd4osu3 on Jan 13, 2010 16:35:44 GMT -5
Gzimm ur trade is vetoed just give it up buddy Im alread sick of reading about it
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Trades
Jan 13, 2010 16:41:49 GMT -5
Post by gzimm32 on Jan 13, 2010 16:41:49 GMT -5
By the way, I'd also argue that Chipper is no longer a solid 3B fantasy option (despite the fact that he was taken early in this draft), and that I'd consider Michael Young marginal. If you're going to have Chipper and Young listed as "solid" 3b, then I can list you a number of other "solid" shortstops.
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Trades
Jan 13, 2010 16:45:25 GMT -5
Post by gzimm32 on Jan 13, 2010 16:45:25 GMT -5
Todd, you're going to make me a little mad if you keep talking. You're irritated others already, and now I understand why they get irritated. What you should shut up and understand is that I already said it was fine with me if the trade didn't go through. Just ask Matt about what we've already decided. Instead of listening to reason though you post, and then expect someone else not to? Do you realize how many more posts you have than everyone else on here? If you haven't noticed, you're not in charge of this league (neither am I), so you don't just tell someone how it is. You have a discussion about it. We have, and you have yet to say anything worthwhile.
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Trades
Jan 13, 2010 16:48:19 GMT -5
Post by donbrockus on Jan 13, 2010 16:48:19 GMT -5
even without chipper and young thats 10 solid 3B compared to... 6 SS.
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Trades
Jan 13, 2010 16:51:58 GMT -5
Post by donbrockus on Jan 13, 2010 16:51:58 GMT -5
heres an idea. let's name the shortstops better than tulo. and let's name the third basemen better than beckham.
SS Hanley ..... ... ok then
3B A Rod Wright Reynolds Zimmerman Longo Youk Figgins Sandoval maybe Aramis (age might give beckham the edge here)
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Trades
Jan 13, 2010 17:29:14 GMT -5
Post by gzimm32 on Jan 13, 2010 17:29:14 GMT -5
Don, thank you for continuing to at least make congent points. The thing is though, having taken into account ALL factors involved in a trade in a league with this specific setup, I came to a different conclusion than you did. Todd is right about one thing: it isn't worth it to continue to debate the trade that Matt and I were going to make. What it comes down to is we'd like this to be a fun league and if this trade threatens that then we'll put it off for now and revisit it with a little different makeup later. I'll be glad to debate your player analysis here though.
Yep, last season Tulo may have ranked as the #2 SS. I think is probably his best case scenario. Beckham will not rank behind all of those 3B (even though he won't be a 3B this season anyway) at the end of this season though. I'm guessing you're admitting that you didn't balance your lists of "solid" SS and "solid" 3B before, seeing as you've moved away from that. What I think you're overvaluing is position here. If I have more strength at other positions and don't get great production out of SS, that's ok by me.
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Trades
Jan 13, 2010 17:55:07 GMT -5
Post by Matt on Jan 13, 2010 17:55:07 GMT -5
Todd you really need to stop. Don is actully prodiving factual points with his reason for why he didn't liked the trade. You, on the other hand, are only complaining about it. If you are so sick of what he is saying then don't read it. It is not that hard.
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